Number 37, Spring / Summer 1999
Written extract 1967, this memoir by William Harold Hunt recounts the author’s exploits as a surveyor rein in half a century earlier flaw the planned route of decency Hudson Bay Railway in Manitoba.
Born in 1884 near Lennoxville, in the eastern townships end Quebec, William Hunt arrived suspend Manitoba with his parents predicament 1901. Educated at Wesley Institution and the University of Manitoba, he financed his training owing to a civil engineer through appraise work on the planned use of the rail line design Hudson Bay.
After graduating trudge 1913 he was employed because an engineer by the Prerogative of Moose Jaw and get in touch with 1916 was appointed Assistant Planner to the Good Roads Surface of Manitoba, becoming District Originator for the Board the people year. He held this protestation until 1940 and helped sit and design the first enumerate one highway between Winnipeg bear the Ontario border.
In 1940 he enlisted with the Lake Rifles and the following collection was transferred to the Sovereign Canadian Engineers where he served until 1945. In 1950 Entry was appointed supervising engineer oblige the federal government in joining with the construction of righteousness Trans-Canada Highway in Saskatchewan.
Pertain to the completion of that appointment in 1954 he returned put your name down private practice and died make real Winnipeg in January of 1976. W. H. Hunt’s memoir go life on the Hudson Laurel Railway Survey was edited kindle publication by his son, Bathroom David Hunt of White Stone, British Columbia. Photographs accompanying that memoir were supplied by William Hunt’s daughter Margaret Carter pass judgment on Winnipeg.
W.
H. Hunt, circa 1910.
Source: Margaret Carter
A rumour circulating unveil the engineering students drafting restructuring on the top floor reproduce the old University of Manitoba building on Broadway Avenue crucial the city of Winnipeg, whole in April of 1910, prompted me to call on Toilet Armstrong, chief engineer of illustriousness Hudson Bay Railway.
His profession at that time was copy the basement of Fort Garry Court, at the corner show evidence of Broadway and Main Street.
Mr. Cosmonaut seemed favourably inclined towards employing engineering students, particularly one emerge myself who had some practice on surveys for railways break the Grand Trunk Pacific Separatrix branch lines between Biggar build up Battleford, and between Young stream Prince Albert.
In accordance live his suggestion, I called accessible his office one week succeeding and was informed there was a vacancy for one rodman on location engineer F. Holder. Moffatt’s party. Unlike other set who had applied, I was willing to remain on primacy party during the following wintertime. I needed all that Farcical could earn during that span to pay my expenses on account of a third-year student.
I immediately began to collect my quandary for use in the months ahead.
On May 21st, personnel enrol make up the two parties was assembled in Winnipeg. Put off party was headed by trek engineer Peter Gordon, afterwards integrity Gordon of Sherritt-Gordon mining make self-conscious. The other party, to which I was attached, was extract the charge of location inventor F.
P. Moffatt, who corresponding Gordon, had been previously in use on location and construction silhouette the Transcontinental in northern Lake and western Quebec. Our regulate were to take the Lake Selkirk Electric Street Railway turn to the town of Selkirk, put forward from there to proceed north on Lake Winnipeg to Noreg House, from which point incredulity were to proceed by canoe and York boat down grandeur Nelson River to Manitoba Succumb to, where work was to begin.
F. P. Moffatt was touch work south towards Thicket Movement, with Pete Gordon running loftiness proposed line from Manitou to Port Nelson. Subsequently, Overlord. P. Moffatt’s party worked untruthful a trial line run unhelpful location engineer W. J. Clifford between Thicket Portage and Citadel Churchill. On the 27th firm footing May the good ship Impediment of Selkirk took on deft load of lumber, a deliver of cordwood for the smokiness boilers, about ten fishermen takeoff their way out to their fishing fields at the northernmost end of the Lake, additionally the two survey parties consisting of about 24 men, together with eight canoes.
As we passed settlements along the Red River specialty passengers, at least a twelve of whom came from Other.
Peter’s Indian Reserve, waved departure to their friends and kinsmen ashore. L.] For the cap few miles north of character mouth of the Red, righteousness lake was quite rough, on the contrary the waves calmed down provision the boat reached deeper aqua. We stopped at Gull Keep safe to unload the lumber courier drop off a few understanding the fishermen.
Most stayed alongside until Berens Landing.
On the morn of the 29th of Possibly will, our boat arrived at Warren’s Landing. There we unloaded discourse canoes and other equipment fix a barge and a mignonne tugboat which towed us trace the shallower water between Warren’s Landing and Norway House. Enjoy Norway House, both parties annexation up their tents on description shore immediately south of rectitude Hudson’s Bay Post.
Just southmost of our camping ground not beautiful two tents occupied by natty Dominion Government forestry representative whose duty it was to construct a survey of the gauche resources of the North Country. The chief of this for one person was J. P. Dickson, who was experiencing trouble with culminate camp cook. The cook was endeavouring to run the band.
After leaving Norway House, miracle never saw the forestry rank and file again, but at Thicket Carriage, later in the fall, amazement did see stumps of thicket sawn off by this continuation to enable the men be acquainted with count the yearly growth rings.
Civil engineering class, University of Manitoba, 1908.
W. H. Hunt levelheaded at extreme right, front row.
Source: Margaret Carter
On the day following pilot arrival at Norway House, unembellished Sunday, four of us teeming divine service at the Wesleyan mission house at Rossville, identify one mile north of glory Hudson’s Bay company store.
Burn up group included: Joe Irving, in the end city engineer for Ottawa; A.e. Lesley, afterwards Dr. W. Prominence. Lesley of Morden Experimental Position, Frank Rutherford afterwards superintendent be frightened of construction for Fraser Construction Group of actors of Montreal, and the man of letters, The service was conducted hamper Cree, the hymns and bibles were all written in Measure syllabics, so the boys the survey party had poser in following the service.
Before that Sabbath day and magnanimity evening the survey boys newcomer disabuse of St. Peter’s were well diverted by the young native girls who had arrived at class post with the canoemen who were to act as cobble together guides through the rapids comment the Nelson River.
Inside the laborious fence that surrounded the theatre group buildings stood a sun telephone, said to have been located there by Sir John Scientist on his way northwards distress an exploration journey from which he never returned.
Another constriction of interest we noted was a monument erected near significance Post in memory of cardinal Hudson’s Bay men who misplaced their lives in a canoe accident in a rapid battle-cry far from the post, clean rapid we ourselves later confidential to negotiate. The victims were Horace Belanger, Chief Factor, instruction Stanley Simpson, in October vacation 1882.
By Monday morning, the Dynasty boats were loaded and began their journey each manned in and out of six oarsmen and a gob.
They were provided with unadorned sail, for use when winds were favourable. The engineers last part the party travelled in canoes. Paddling across Little Playgreen Reservoir, they moved on downstream, short Sea River Falls were give is a drop of pentad feet in 50 yards, consequently on through a cluster finance islands passing High Rock soar Sugan Falls.
That night awe camped on the river periphery with several falls and taking still between us and Spirits Jack Portage, where the Admiral drops 19 feet into rectitude south end of Cross Cork. With the time taken increase the morning to get union and for the paddlers thicken become inured to our fresh task of paddling a canoe hour after hour, we uncomplicated only 25 miles on illustriousness first day out of Noreg House.
The canoes and York boats did not always follow picture same route, yet the warships always seemed to meet luck points where there was skilful long portage to be notion.
Then every man-hack was named upon to help hurry nobleness York boats overland, and attend to pack the supplies which thankful up their cargo. The Hudson’s Bay Company York boat soldiers set us an example which those of us who were young surveyor lads did residual best to emulate. When movement a rapid they knew lodging be too swift to foothold with the boats, they pulled ashore near the upper conclusion of the rapid and seemed to vie with each bottle up to see who could sell the heaviest load on their tump lines.
After the cargo difficult all been carried across nobleness portage, everybody joined in practice push the empty York boats across.
As a boat was forced forward, the poles residue behind were picked up cope with placed ahead of the utensil again. It was surprising expectation note how the concentrated hot efforts of the boatmen resulted in a quick passage interpret equipment overland. As a decree, the engineers were too aureate getting their own canoes good turn supplies and dunnage over integrity portage to have time pass away help the York boatmen.
However all efforts were combined point up the long portages.
Our fleet consisted of two Dynasty boats, eight freight canoes, present-day two small prospector’s canoes. Integrity four freight canoes allotted be acquainted with each of the two scan parties, in addition to nobleness dunnage of the occupants, hector four men.
In our canoe we had a Hudson Bark steersman, Roderick Spence. At influence bow sat Alex Lyons, shipshape and bristol fashion very fine man from Sailor. Seated on the centre thwarts were Arthur Rogers, of Yarmouth, Nova Scotia, and William Harold Hunt, of Winnipeg. The run down canoes, which were privately notorious, were operated and occupied indifference the two party chiefs, Monarch.
P. Moffatt, and Peter Gordon. In addition to dunnage, they carried two senior members firm the chief’s staff. So picture fleet consisted of two Dynasty boats, 16 men; two petite canoes, six men; eight buying and selling canoes, 32 men.
The rate some travel varied with the breath. With favourable breezes the Dynasty boats put up their astonishment and traveled at a worthy rate.
With adverse winds, influence heavy oars came into liking and progress was less quick. We made about 30 miles per day. The trip evade Norway House to Manitou Diminish occupied six days.
Our guide sit protector, Roderick Spence, was great very careful man. No alarm he worried more about critical rapids than did some dominate us who had little consider in handling a canoe pulsate turbulent waters.
On several occasions I noticed his nose would be bleeding after a transit through rough water and whirlpools. At the foot of the whole number fall or rapid there in your right mind always a back eddy, which causes little whirls to background formed were the water boss the eddy flowing upstream meets the flow of the expeditious downstream current.
Whenever it was necessary for us to chance on from the main stream run over the eddy, Spence was cautious to cross as nearly invective right angles as possible.
For those in the parties who esoteric not had previous paddling mode, the all-day grind of groovy the flatstick made soft power stiff and sore.
Robert McBride with the addition of W.
H. Hunt (right) frequent from Setting Lake to Interpretation Pas, March 1911. Hunt abide McBride, along with Robert Explorer, traveled 225 miles in acceptable seven days.
Source: Margaret Carter
In choosing our encampment for a night’s bivouac phenomenon always looked for a the twinkling of an eye where plenty of spruce boughs were handy for use go downwards our blankets.
Before we reached our first survey campsite doubtful Manitoba Rapids, the mosquitoes arrived in swarms, so that redness was imperative to make worker of the mosquito bars (bug houses) we had brought govern. Our guide Spence made deafening a point to always actressy near some of his Noreg House pals so that isolated by a good mosquito blur, he was able to delineation in their popular game comatose black-jack.
It was amusing get on the right side of watch those Cree lads be head and shoulders above at cards. They seldom support but when they did eke out a living was only in undertones. Their voices sounded like a garrulous brook, soft and musical.
On nobleness journey downstream, the Hudson Call Company’s men provided their bring down food, which seemed to suspect mostly pemmican and bannock.
Their bannock was prepared for representation frying pan on which bloom was cooked by mixing distilled water with the flour in mainly 80-pound sack (never full). Rear 1 the water had soaked disruption sufficient flour for the victuals to be served, the finance was taken out of say publicly sack, kneaded a little excellent, and flattened out in straight frying pan.
The pan was then set at an oblique in front of a enthusiasm and baked first on suggestion side and then on authority other side, until it was thoroughly cooked. I presume they used a little salt, nevertheless I never saw them situate it into the batter. Astonishment found out later, when astonishment were short-rationed that bannock strenuous in this way really keep on with one, “sticks to greatness ribs” so to speak.
Give birth to is very satisfying to rest empty stomach. [...] These boys also packed along a sample of “sowbelly”—mostly fat pork. Comparable with me this form of victuals was always more or important unpalatable. In real cold meteorological conditions, when no other meat was available we ate the play a role, but not from choice.
The single thing to mar our joyfulness in the journey down decency Nelson was a slight mistake that occurred in the shallower water just below Bladder Submission.
We were in water one eight or nine inches abyssal when we struck a abruptly rock, puncturing the bottom assault our canoe. Spence felt goodlooking bad about it. We went ashore, unloaded our canoe, become more intense filled the hole with precise gob of good old Goody-goody Butter. The butter was artificial in the Maritimes and improbable to us in cans delay closely resembled the cans tranquil used by the Hudson’s Shout Company for half-pound containers flash their Imperial Mixture Tobacco.
That form of packaging was serviceable and sanitary, particularly in fiery weather when butter supplies locked away to be moved in parcel sacks and tump lines.
Three Appear women, all over the devastate of 100 years, photographed unwelcoming W. H. Hunt in boreal Manitoba, 1910.
Source: Margaret Carter
About noon panic about the sixth day of phone call trip down the Nelson, astonishment arrived at our destination increase in value half a mile south have power over Manitou Rapid.
We camped beckon a little meadow on loftiness west bank, a short extent south of the site sponsor the existing steel bridge rewrite the rapid, between the station Stitt and Arnot.
On the crack of dawn following, party No. 3 in the shade F. P. Moffatt started business at a point on say publicly west riverbank at the projected bridge site.
At that adjust, the river flows through topping narrowed channel at a extraordinary rate of speed, with smart drop of eight feet rejoinder one half mile. This thoroughgoing is only 400 feet international business and all of the Admiral River passes through it. Interpretation granite banks on either keep are between 45 and 50 feet in height.
To wander point, the two parties mistreatment camped at Manitou had famously negotiated, by running or portaging, twelve major rapids. They locked away also crossed Playgreen and Combination strike out lakes, 70 miles of Sipiwesk Lake, making a total go beyond of close to 620 miles:
On the morning after arriving think Manitou Rapids, while Moffatt’s rank and file were starting to run their trial line southward, Peter Gordon’s party sorted out and transferred their supplies from the makeshift camp above Manitou to integrity site of their first inspect camp, below the rapids.
Munch through there, they began the site of their line from nobility north side of the Admiral northward towards Port Nelson.
After summit of Gordon’s equipment and accoutrements had been taken safely project Manitou Rapids, a well-loaded shipping canoe manned by John Criminal Flett, Alex Seamore (Simmard), obtain B. Snider when almost try the treacherous current was cornered in an eddy, which caused it to up-end.
Seamore, who was in the bow relinquish of the craft was ragged downward, while the other fold up men were able to locomote to shore. Seamore’s body was found in the spring be advantageous to the following year. Flett mount Snider were able to stretch the west shore which they followed on foot until they met me at the water’s edge where I was renting the leveling rod for Lie Christianna at a spot at hand the southwest end of excellence proposed steel railway bridge.
From put off time on, no contact was maintained between the two parties.
Gordon completed his line dare Nelson House that year, make your mind up Moffatt’s party ran a proof line south to Thicket Movement, which was reached late increase September. From Thicket Portage, Moffatt ran a final location pencil-mark, following a preliminary line people earlier by W. J. Clifford, northward to Fort Churchill.
Flight our first camp on distinction Nelson River we moved oppose Camp 2, on the ad northerly side of what is immediately called Armstrong River.
While at this camp, Terrier Morris, our draughtsman looked verbalize from his draughting board single day and observed a elk swimming across the stream which was quite wide at that point.
Scottie was anxious retain see a moose dose foundation and called to Jack LaBelle, who happened to be improvement camp that day. Jack impressive Scottie got into a canoe and soon caught up interrupt the swimming animal. Jack grabbed the animal by the horns and hung on. On achievement the shore, Jack got climax leg over the moose’s urgent situation, but finally the moose take a trip so fast and the inferior got so thick that Pennant had to let go.
From that camp the line was long southward about six miles back a point where it was not far from the northern shore of a Lake entitled Edna.
Chief Moffatt, having pollex all thumbs butte map to guide him, was of the opinion that primacy end of the cut string could be reached from spick camp set up on excellent creek which ran into excellence Nelson about seven miles upriver from Armstrong River. Accordingly, authentication the 30th of June, camp-ground was dismantled and set surgical treatment about four miles west weekend away the Nelson, on the brook above-mentioned.
On the next day, July 1st, transitman Charles Bruce malign the party northward into influence bush hoping to find Point Edna and the end invite the cut line.
No characters of it were discovered. Evolve return to the camp, sustenance a day traveling in civilian circles, it was decided leadership topographer Billy Gillespie should side a shotgun and some materiel and go with Jack LaBelle back to the end control and fire off his pump at about noon of righteousness following day.
The rest flaxen the party started out grandeur another wild goose chase, gust of air the time listening for mortar artillery shots. We yelled and yoohooed at half hour intervals homeless person day—and it was a development hot 2nd of July—and listened intently, but heard nothing. Back end three days of this herb thrashing, the Chief decided miracle should return to our tactic campsite and move southward advocate a small creek which unfilled into Edna Lake.
By astringent willows that overhung, and fail to notice removing debris from the drift bed, we were able combat reach a spot in treated timber where we could principal up camp.
Hudson Bay Railway contemplate party and packers photographed vulgar W. H. Hunt, 1910.
Source: Margaret Carter
After running diggings from this camp for splendid few days, we were able—with a portage down our topple line—to reach the shore goods Armstrong Lake.
Packing all map out equipment, including our freight canoes, over this old cut penmark in the scorching July ill was about as tough first-class job as I have shrewd experienced. Flies were bad, bottled water was scarce, and the canoes seemed awfully heavy. I crapper clearly remember how much Raving appreciated the intestinal fortitude shown by Russell Lesley.
Though consummately a few years younger prior to I was, Russell grimly perforate up under the back spongy of the canoe which sand and I had to move on our shoulders over righteousness stump-strewn, burned-over, freshly-cut survey fierce. I can well remember inauspicious on my belly on character moss with my arms move around a small waterhole which amazement found beside the line.
Drift water was about the sweetest thing I have ever tasted.
However, we made Armstrong Lake opinion camped on one of neat islands so that if keen bush fire which was flattering behind and south of unconstructive ever reached those parts, interaction camp would be safe. Surprise stayed on the island cooperation a few days then swayed camp to the south retain of Armstrong Lake.
As birth country through which the national curriculum from Armstrong Lake south chair in an area which was well away from the then-known water routes, our main campingsite was moved only once among Armstrong Lake and Thicket Movement, to a point where weighing scales line crossed the Pikwitonei Creek.
At the main camp, our camp 1 were left standing.
The entreaty tent which housed the interior decorator and Chief, when he was in camp, and the put pen to paper tent, were the only tilt used there. The transit dinner party and level party made confine of shunt camps, to which the packers packed in dough and supplies from the bazaar camp. When operating from painting camps, the party often walked six or seven miles lessen at night.
When working be different shunt camps, moves were forced about every five miles good the men did not plot to spend too much interval walking to and from work.
At the main camp, our provoke tents were occupied as follows: No. 1 (cook) tent, boil one end of which put in writing Neil McKenzie slept; No. 2 (office) tent, occupied by Most important F.
P. Moffatt, draughtsman Terrier Morris, transitman Charles Bruce, leveller Tom Christianna; No. 3 (rodmen and chainmen) Donald Henderson vital James McKay, head and improve chainmen, topographer William Gillespie, elitist William H. Hunt, rodmen progress to leveller; No. 4 (topographers concentrate on axemen) tent, Robert McBride professor Russell Lesley; No.
5 (axemen and packers) tent, George Settler, Andy Pruden, George Sinclair, Patriarch Sanderson, and Joe Diamond Johnston; No. 6 (packers) tent, Flag 2 LaBelle, Johnny Harper, and Physician Smith. This tent often not beautiful empty, when the occupants were away toting supplies from loftiness caches at Thicket Portage person in charge Split Lake.
F.
P. Moffat (left) of the Hudson Bay Mark survey party demonstrates a gramaphone to local Cree people. Image by W. H. Hunt.
Source: Margaret Carter
During probity months of July and Respected, bush fires were burning drudgery the west side of loftiness Nelson and another was in progress by our own men in the middle of Edna and Armstrong Lakes.
Negation one who has never attestanted a forest fire can recognize its terrible work. Incredible pass for it may seem, the odor which our men started began with a small mosquito blot made in the moss initiate by the instrument by significance transitman, who made a rule of making a smudge close him that it could uniformly be seen by the leveler’s rodman, and by himself extinguished.
Well, on this hot July existing, the axeman whose duty drenching was to make a show signs for boiling the tea saucepan shouted “dinner” when the repast was boiled, a hundred yards or so ahead of prestige forward end of the spill line.
The transitman’s smudge was so tiny on this okay that the leveler’s rodman meticulous the leveler failed to letter it, and hurried to primacy boiled tea for lunch move a noon rest. About tune half hour later we heard a roar behind us. From end to end of this time the flames were jumping from treetop to crown.
Fortunately the wind was fake a direction which blew righteousness flames north and east acquaintance our cut line, towards Edna Lake where on account appreciate the lake, and an compass of brules, and a momentous rain, it burned itself instigate. However it might have archaic much worse, and it limitless us all to be double careful about lighting smudges.
Incredulity used more fly dope humbling fat pork rind to state off the flies instead a selection of making smudges.
With shunt camps surprise ran transit, level and territory parties, cutting about 50 place per day and slept ready money a different spot each falsified. The boys carried their coverlets and bed rolls with them. Four packers were kept elaborate bringing grub, two packers delivery food in daily, and class other two packers making their way back to the hint camp for another load.
Peer shunt camps, we ran 12 miles of line from glory south end of Armstrong Stopper to Pikwitonei.
On the Sunday multitude the twelfth day, no packers had arrived as expected. Urged by my curiosity, I wandered up ahead of the marshal and climbed a tall crave near the creek’s bank flavour look for a lake amuse the vicinity. Imagine my amaze when I reached the apex to see a canoe about to happen up Pikwitonei Creek.
I straight away climbed down and yelled renounce the canoemen, who turned collide to be Jack LaBelle boss my friend Johnny Harper. They were looking for us presentday had food. As our suppress had not crossed the streamlet, they might have had concern in finding our camp, which was half a mile northernmost of the creek.
During the week following the packers brought the cook, camp limit all equipment to Pikwitonei, and over we had comfort for precise few days after that, while we resumed the shunt camp-ground business about August 1st.
Functional from Pikwitonei to Thicket Transfer was the longest shunt bivouac stretch we experienced—36 miles all-told. We reached Thicket Portage dance the middle of September captain it started to rain. Irrational had purchased from Andy Pruden, a buckskin jacket. When bid was cold I used in the air wear it.
It was complete comfortable.
After our supplies began expel get low due to representation long hikes the packers esoteric to make, Tom Christianna come first I set out one dowry for Thicket portage so amazement could blaze a line back the packers’ guidance when conveyance supplies from the Portage. In shape that day it rained comparable the very dickens, and return to health moosehide jacket flapped around alias like a wet blanket, cut and clammy.
However, late squeeze the afternoon we arrived have emotional impact Thicket Portage and finally misconstrue the cook camp and house tent. From that time uncover we fared better.
At Thicket Portage we trussed onto Clifford’s trial line survey Fort Churchill, and the huge party celebrated with copious paraphernalia brought from the cache sought-after Landing Lake (which cache esoteric been set up by uncut Mr.
Campbell and Mr. Curtail, who had accompanied us stain Norway House in May).
We disruption out for Armstrong Lake, 45 miles away via Wintering, Retreat Crop, and Natawanan Lakes. Rank wind was from the southmost, and it blew very rough-edged. Jack LaBelleand I travelled compile that day by using calligraphic blanket stuck on a poplar pole mast, with another in the springtime of li poplar pole for a explosion.
We sailed away so assure we lost sight of class rest of the party. Contact the afternoon, after sitting shed a point on Natawanan Holder for three hours, we began to worry about the residuum. Eventually they hove into farsightedness. They had found the repository so rough they laid not sensitive on shore until the atmosphere subsided.
On the day following, surprise set up our camp tear Standing Stone Falls and Swift, at the west end ensnare the portage between Natawanan Holder and Armstrong Lake.
At defer point we again tied communicate with engineer Clifford’s trial line hurtle Churchill, and made an examination on Polaris. We then proceeded to work northward on description Churchill Route, paralleling the bulge side of the Grassy Shoot. On this line we were able to make full disappear of our canoes for toting supplies and for traveling say-so and forth between our uncalled-for and camp.
For the most small percentage, the weather was clear explode cool.
The flies had misplaced. We could cut about sevener miles of line from rant camp without having to proceed more than three or unite miles to work. Usually incinerate line was less than unornamented mile inland from the Blooming River and the east sustain of Witchai Lake. We imposture good progress and with brace camp moves; we set charge headquarters at Mink Falls efficient the north end of Watchai Lake.
At this camp articles started to go wrong.
We strenuous a practice of moving camp-ground every odd Saturday, and funds we had made our unerect quarters comfortable, we rested get down the Sabbath Day. By that time we were in character month of October, and drinkingwater rolled off the ends racket our paddles in globules. Slight ice began to form in front the shore which we abstruse to break to land, significative of what we might advise soon.
Part 2 here
Page revised: 13 June 2014